CASAA Call to Action: This is a follow up post to my previous post titled Vapers: Are ejuice vendors properly disclosing the contents of their ejuice? Their is more to this story. Other sites have published great articles which I think you should read and I also want to try and correct any ambiguity in my previous post.
Oliver Kershaw, the founder of ECF has published a Blog post titled Confused about diacetyl? You should be. Their is tremendous value when a recognized vaping Community leader speaks from years and years of experience to paint a clear picture of the issues.
“This really is the e-cig industry’s zombie issue. It keeps coming back year after year, but never resolved. And it’s a complex one which divides opinion. In this piece, I’m not looking to hash out the rights or wrongs of the companies involved in the latest sagas or to talk about the particulars of these cases, but to draw out some of the perspectives that mean this issue may never be fully resolved.”
This article contains references to a scientific study conducted by Dr. Konstantinos E. Farsalinos. The complete study (NOT a summary) is titled Evaluation of Electronic Cigarette Liquids and Aerosol for the Presence of Selected Inhalation Toxins. A summary poster for your reading pleasure.
The Marketplace and Court of Public Opinion Has Spoken!
The Electronic Cigarette Trade Association of Canada has instructed their 50 members to remove certain flavors of Five Pawns ejuice. As per this .pdf which they released:
A bold and admirable move. It’s important to also point out the very detailed and specific requirements their members must adhere to via The Electronic Cigarette Trade Association of Canada’s E-Liquid Testing requirements. Compare that document to the The American E-LIQUID Manufactering Stanadards document titled Standards 2015 Version 2.2. This document lacks specivity, details, and is very poorly written. A very disappointing effort. All they say is:
“Flavorings containing Custard Notes will identify advertising and product descriptions(iv) Water used (if any) will be either deionized or distilled (v) Alcohol and additional additives (if any) will be:
1) Used in the purest form commercially available and safe for human consumption 2) Minimum of US Food grade standards”
REALLY! Telling me “Note: Diacetyl and Acetyl Propionyl (2,3 – Pentanedione) standards are undergoing active re-‐evaluations. All standards amendments are posted immediately after ratifications.” This statement means absolutely nothing. Deploy similar SPECIFIC standards of ECTA of Canada in your Standard Document and require your members adherence. PLEASE!
Smoker’s Angel E-Cig Shops which appear to have a large presence in the UK and also appear as a web site aka or division. They have removed all Five Pawns ejuice from their web site and twelve B&Ms. See this page
The 5P Page on this site says:
” You may have heard rumours that Five Pawns e-liquid has tested positive for the diketones Diacetyl and Acetyl Propionyl (AP). Both Diacetyl and Acetyl Propionyl (AP) were detected at levels that cannot be attributed to contamination. We do not support the use of these ingredients in e-liquid and as a responsible retailer of electronic cigarette hardware and e-liquid, we’ve made the decision to remove these products from our store until we have verified the accuracy of the results and received an explanation from the manufacturer. This page will be updated when we have further information. ” Source
The Vaping Community continues to discuss this issue. Naturally the 5P Haters and Cloud 9 second guessers have emerged with some remarks that are frankly crude, specious, self centered, showing off, bloviating, and a total waste of bandwidth. I’m not prepared to call Five Pawns a “liar” until my tired old eyes actually see “reliable” evidence. Sure, I’ve seen some email text screen captures posted on other sites and this one, but for myself and my standards, that’s not enough to use the term “liar”. However, when I read a post from a long time and level headed vapor who is highly respected like Mr. Mann, it carries a tremendous amount of veracity for me. Mr. Mann thinks Five Pawns CEO and President/Founder, Rodney Jerabek mislead him. Not YOU or ME but Mr. Mann. Please draw your own conclusions from his post:
“Preferring this to stay as amicable as possible, we can just agree to disagree based on what we both believe. Just know that ultimately what I believe is coming from one that fell madly in love with them exactly two years and a month ago today. I remember vividly the conversation and the questions I asked them (and I talked to Rodney) that day I got their liquid ( I always, especially back then, had a set of questions I asked vendors). I won’t get messy and say what I “remember” about what was told to me because that is not going to hold water. Suffice it to say, I have my reasons to believe what I believe based on my experiences and you will do the same. My experiences are my evidence. Yours are yours. The fall out is evidence of the retailers’ experiences.” Source
Not to worry. You will read my candid thoughts at the conclusion of this Blog post so please keep reading after you take a coffee and or vape break. Naturally Cloud 9 Vaping has responded and please remember that their are attorneys involved so each and every word is carefully measured.
“Our own solicitors have responded in robust terms rejecting allegations made by Five Pawns, and they have now released their own test results, and it is incontrovertible that liquid produced by Five Pawns contains the compounds in question.” Source It’s worth reminding folks again, exactly what Cloud 9 states on their Our liquid testing protocol Blog post. I suggest you read the entire document. It’s candid, detailed, no abaguity or spin. Arguably, one of the few vendors on planet Earth or Mars who is willing to set such outstanding standards. All of this from an essentially Mom and Pop operation! The concluding paragraph:
“In the recent past, we removed a well-known premium e-liquid range from sale because our test results indicated very high levels of Diacetyl (testing showed up to 100 ppm or 0.01%), and extremely high levels of Acetyl Propionyl (testing showed up to 2500 ppm or 0.25%). We trusted the manufacturer was doing their own due diligence, but this experience was a reminder that there are no shortcuts. We are not prepared to take risks with your health and our company reputation, and do not stock any new liquid products until the supplier has provided comprehensive analysis performed by a known, accredited & independent laboratory, or we have performed our own analysis.” Source
I’m a stakeholder
I vividly remember the first day I discovered Gambit about 1.5 years ago. What a fantastic and well crafted mix. Yes, Flamingoes DID fly around my crib. 🙂 Then came Perpetual Check, which until recently was my after dinner delight. As a DIY geek, I have a huge amount of respect and admiration for the talents which are necessary to produce mixes of this caliber. Although some of the other Five Pawns mixes were not to my liking, I still marveled at the talents involved. At a certain level, this Five Pawns Tragedy saddens me a great deal. It’s negative implications for the Vaping industry and the negative impact (hand them red meat) on our respective activism efforts only makes me more skeptical about the survival of vaping, post FDA regulations. Think “Self Regulation” and my answer is unfortunately, highly unlikely.
My Own Position
The actions of Five Pawns is morally and ethically repugnant. And, you can quote me on that! My decision to never vape or purchase any Five Pawns juices is based on the following:
- The Five Pawns test results they posted: SEE TEST RESULTS HERE And the page also contains these links to other lab test results for their juices: Test Results and Test Results. These testing results show SKY HIGH levels of DA and or AP in many of their juices.
- Their deplorable “SPIN” in the Five Pawns – Be Informed Blog Post. See my previous post with details.
- Their lack of clarity and the apples and oranges ploy they use on their Our Story page:
“We’re perfectionists and refuse to allow any liquid to leave our facility before it’s absolutely perfect. We use only USP / food grade ingredients and the best premium pharmaceutical grade nicotine. “ - The optics of using a C&D to silence Cloud 9 rather than reformulating their juices.
Because of the deplorable actions of Five Pawns, they have joined my Vaping Hall Of Shame. Congratulations and best wishes for a long and prosperous Corporate life! /sarcasim
NOTE: Just in case you missed it, my first post on this issue titled Vapers: Are ejuice vendors properly disclosing the contents of their ejuice?
DISCLAIMER/DISCLOSURE: No one asked me to make this post. I do not and will not accept any form of compensation or “in kind” for any post I make. I have purchased a rDNA from Vapor Shark and recently purchased two flavors from Nicoticket. I have also purchased Gambit and Perpetual Check from Five Pawns. I have also purchased equipment from Cloud 9 Vaping. NONE of these vendors were aware of this post and it’s contents before I published it. That’s the way I roll so deal with it. 🙂